Sunday, April 23, 2006

"Horrific consequences"

According to John Loftus:

“Calvinists further claim that the evidential apologetics practiced by Arminians leads people to atheism…”

This statement is less than self-explanatory. There is no official school of apologetics in Calvinism.

Likewise, how many men started out as professing Christians, and were led into atheism through their study of evidential apologetics?

Or is Loftus saying that evidential apologetics only has this effect when it is practiced by Arminians?

“…while Arminians claim that the horrific consequences of Calvinism leads people to atheism.”

How would Calvinism have this effect on people?

If you don’t believe in Calvinism, then you don’t believe that Calvinism has any horrific consequences.

But if you do believe in the consequences of Calvinism, whether “horrific” or not, then you must be a Calvinist rather than an atheist.

8 comments:

  1. “Calvinists further claim that the evidential apologetics practiced by Arminians leads people to atheism…”

    As Steve noted, we have no official school of apologetics.

    A Calvinist apologetic should understand that no apologetic "works" on its own. That requires the Holy Spirit's interaction.

    Those favoring the presuppositional school simply affirm this truth, and we generally think that evidentialism as a method tends to pander to the self-interest of the sinner, at least implicitly.

    Perhaps one day Mr. Loftus will actually get this correct.

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  2. Furthermore, as far as I know, no presuppositionalist would claim that evidential apologetics leads people to atheism. Evidential apologetics has lead people to Christ for centuries.

    Rather, the claim is that evidential apologetics requires first the assumption of an atheistic worldview. Classical apologetics, in the longrun, has won many to Christ. But, the downside is that it requires the rejection of Christ before the embracing of Christ.

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  3. Your own theology in a nutshell was less than self-explanatory. Figure it out if you can. And have a nice day.

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  4. Isn't Loftus a big "expert" on world philosophies and even on Christian apologetics...? And the claim is that the difference between evidentialist and presuppositional apologetics is too tangled and confused for him to understand? Hmm.

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  5. I'm an expert? Nice that you think of me that way. Thanks!

    Sometimes I'm just.....well.....just promoting.....and having fun....but that's not allowed for atheists like me because I don't have an absolute unchanging standard of humor, now do I? ;-)

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  6. Low-life Loftus: Your own theology in a nutshell was less than self-explanatory. Figure it out if you can. And have a nice day.

    Frank Walton: Your own post here is more than self-explanatory. I had it figured out the moment I read it. And have a nice day.

    Loftus' pitiful attempt at humor: Sometimes I'm just.....well.....just promoting.....and having fun....but that's not allowed for atheists like me because I don't have an absolute unchanging standard of humor, now do I? ;-)

    Frank Walton: Your humor is as bad as your blogsite, Loftus. And I'm afraid my assessment here is an absolute.

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  7. Frank. You are sooooo.....so reasonable!

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  8. Wow, Lofty finally speaks the truth!

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