Paul Bunyan

 ICONOCLAST SAID:

Hey, thanks for showing us how pseudo-Christians justify parents' premeditated, deliberate lying to their children.

For someone who allegedly objects to “lying,” it’s revealing to see the ease with which you resort to misrepresentation to advance your cause.

I discuss the case of Santa for the simple reason that some Christians bring that up, then use it to discredit Christmas as a whole.

So I’m responding to them on their own terms. I’m using Santa as a limiting case. Since some Christians cite Santa as a worse-case scenario for all that’s wrong with Christmas, I’m evaluating the quality of their argument.

These parents aren't merely Christians who have fallen into the sin of lying; they are LIARS. There is no LIAR who will enter the kingdom of heaven. All LIARS will have their part in the lake of fire.

So Jeremiah is roasting in hell for deceiving the princes (Jer 38:24-28). Nathan is roasting in hell for deceiving David (2 Sam 12:1-7). Elisha is roasting in hell for deceiving the Syrian army (2 Kgs 16:14-20). Rahab is roasting in hell for deceiving her countrymen (Josh 2; 6). The midwives are roasting in hell for deceiving Pharaoh (Exod 1:15-21). Samuel is roasting in hell for deceiving Saul (1 Sam 16:1-5). Joshua is roasting in hell for deceiving the soldiers of Ai (Josh 8:3-8).

With so many saints in hell, it must be hard to tell the difference between heaven and hell. Is it the décor?

To you, it would be 'overly restrictive' to raise children without stories of ghosts and witchcraft and murderers that give them 'a good scare.' To Christian parents, it would be sinful to raise them on these stories.

It’s sinful to tell boys campfire stories? Sounds like liberals who try to effeminize boys by forbidding them to play dodgeball, &c.

The Bible contains stories about ghosts and witches (e.g. 1 Sam 28)–not to mention murderers of every stripe. Is it also sinful to read the Bible to your kids?

Oh, so we should lie to our children in order to give the children some healthy skepticism. If that's the case, then parents should lie MORE, not less.

I realize that you lack the emotional detachment to have a rational discussion. But I was merely responding to Clark on his own grounds. If Christian parents send their kids to public school, then their kids should acquire a healthy dose of scepticism regarding what grown-ups tell them.

Mind you, if it were up to me, I’d abolish the public school system. But Clark is a 2-Kingdoms proponent, so I doubt he shares my view.

Well, you might as well lie to your kids before they get there, because you're just throwing them to the Philistines.

Here’s an idea for you. Get some ice bags. Put them in the bathtub. Immerse yourself to cool off so that you can begin to see straight. I’m not the one who’s advocating public schools. 

Proverbs 26:28: "A lying tongue HATES the one it crushes." You would have your parents say, "Son, I lied to you because I loved you." This in and of itself is a lie. The lie just gets perpetuated.

You’d need to demonstrate that the author of Prov 26:28 had in mind something like the adventures of Davy Crockett. Just quoting the words of a Bible writer won’t prove your point, for we must take into account the intent of the writer. What was the scope of his statement? To what was he referring?

For instance, does God hate the deception of the Hebrew midwives? No.

Moreover, I didn’t cite the example of my parents to justify the practice. Rather, I cited their example as a counterexample to Clark’s armchair theory about the effect of the Santa myth on kids.

But, of course, to draw that distinction would require a hitherto undeveloped capacity for emotional detachment on your part.

Point made - practical jokes involving deception are wicked.

You’re welcome to your option, which says more about you than the ethics of a college prank (to take one example).

Not a big surprise that you are into movies.

So you also think movies are ipso facto wicked. It’s useful to see a nutty position taken to its logical extreme. Folks like you keep the squirrels well supplied for the winter hibernation.

What, exactly, do you think is wicked about all movies? The fictional element? The life-like element?

Were the parables of Jesus equally wicked?

You justify blatant immorality. That makes you just as much of an immoral pervert as the ones you justify.

As far as that goes, I think far more harm is done to the religious formation of kids by fearful, apoplectic legalists who think telling boys campfire stories or tall tales about Daniel Boone is wicked and sinful and hateful and damnable than by parents who tell their kids the Tooth Fairy left a quarter under their pillow while they slept.

But I suppose their parents will spend eternity in hell alongside the Hebrew midwives.

I guess the deeper question is whether “Iconoclast” is a sockpuppet for Richard Dawkins.