tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6789188.post3515600045523166276..comments2024-03-27T17:15:37.606-04:00Comments on Triablogue: Beckwith on abortionRyanhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17809283662428917799noreply@blogger.comBlogger4125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6789188.post-24268105198337770752008-10-20T10:10:00.000-04:002008-10-20T10:10:00.000-04:00"The problem with the Right is that they want to e...<B>"The problem with the Right is that they want to extend these protections to recently fertilized eggs. Most of us see no "personhood" in such a thing: there are no "symptoms" of life, no pulse, no heart beat, there isn't even a head."</B><BR/><BR/>Ah, yes, Peter, watch out with this one. He's using the very sophisticated "Zombie" criteria of personhood.Errorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10615233201833238198noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6789188.post-82361834305693288682008-10-19T23:16:00.000-04:002008-10-19T23:16:00.000-04:00James said:---Most of us see no "personhood" in su...James said:<BR/>---<BR/>Most of us see no "personhood" in such a thing: there are no "symptoms" of life, no pulse, no heart beat, there isn't even a head.<BR/>---<BR/><BR/>Actually, there are "symptoms" of life (as you put it) because the embryo can be killed.<BR/><BR/>And, FWIW, the right to life is a <I>human</I> right not a "person" right, and it is easy enough to prove that an unborn human fetus is, indeed, a human being (after all, that's what human's produce: human beings).<BR/><BR/>In point of fact, those who try to make the distinction between "person" and "being" get themselves trapped in the arbitrary nature of their selection. What determines which human beings are human persons? If it is level of development, then more developed human beings (i.e., more mature) have more of a right to life than less developed human beings. Ergo, our idea that children should be saved during a crisis is flawed. It should be the adults first.<BR/><BR/>If it is based on level of consciousness, then is the man with a higher IQ more worthy to be saved during a crisis?<BR/><BR/>(And this comes into conflict with the above: what if we are dealing with a healthy but dull child and Stephen Hawkins, who is not as fully developed because he cannot walk; which do we save in a crisis?)<BR/><BR/>All of these questions are only relevant if the debate is structured in terms of "personhood" rather than "being." The ontology of the fetus is crystal clear. And I daresay that there are very few people (especially on the pro-choice side) who can actually give a philosophical argument as to the difference between a person and a being in the first place.Peter Pikehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11792036365040378473noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6789188.post-11805301232902918572008-10-19T19:27:00.000-04:002008-10-19T19:27:00.000-04:00Most people do not reflect on this issue other tha...Most people do not reflect on this issue other than to state the same talking points the politicians do: either abortion is murder or it's a fundamental "right".<BR/><BR/>Perhaps the best way to approach it would be to simply question what criteria should be used to determine when a living being should have constitutional rights. What makes an infant three days before delivery less worthy of protection simply because he hasn't traveled out of the birth canal? <BR/><BR/>I think most people (with the exception of Peter Singer) would come to the conclusion that biological dependency alone does not determine unworthiness for civil protections. If it did, we would suggest that infants and toddlers, due to depending on their mother for nursing, could be left for dead on a street somewhere. <BR/><BR/>The problem with the Right is that they want to extend these protections to recently fertilized eggs. Most of us see no "personhood" in such a thing: there are no "symptoms" of life, no pulse, no heart beat, there isn't even a head. Perhaps if the ideologues dropped the insistence that fetuses be protected from conception, they might get somewhere.Jameshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05387448864812957107noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6789188.post-41931604928787444282008-10-19T17:37:00.000-04:002008-10-19T17:37:00.000-04:00This comment has been removed by the author.dogfreidhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13751614375780546890noreply@blogger.com