tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6789188.post2906440908501044089..comments2024-03-27T17:15:37.606-04:00Comments on Triablogue: IlleismRyanhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17809283662428917799noreply@blogger.comBlogger4125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6789188.post-48856452350107214632018-05-13T19:13:39.646-04:002018-05-13T19:13:39.646-04:00Here's the relevant part of Augustine's wo...<a href="http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/npnf104.iv.ix.xix.html" rel="nofollow">Here's</a> the relevant part of Augustine's work. He cites some examples to illustrate his argument. Though the Pentateuch refers to Moses in the third person, its Mosaic authorship was widely accepted in antiquity. That reflects how familiar the people of the ancient world were with speaking of yourself in the third person. Augustine also notes that the gospels themselves support the practice outside of the context of Matthew's authorship. They have Jesus speaking of himself in the third person. And the fourth gospel alternates between referring to the beloved disciple in the third person without qualification and identifying him as the author.Jason Engwerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17031011335190895123noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6789188.post-66488921693576237852018-05-13T18:29:50.960-04:002018-05-13T18:29:50.960-04:00Lydia mentioned Augustine's response to Faustu...Lydia mentioned Augustine's response to Faustus. The document provides a lot of valuable information about the authorship attributions of the gospels in antiquity, <a href="http://triablogue.blogspot.com/2015/07/how-widely-was-matthean-authorship.html" rel="nofollow">as I've discussed elsewhere</a>. The section Lydia referred to is 17:4 of Augustine's Reply To Faustus The Manichaean. That's where Augustine responds to Faustus' objection. You can read the objection itself in 17:1.<br /><br />Augustine seems to have considered speaking of yourself in the third person so common that he criticizes Faustus for acting as if he's ignorant of the practice: "Faustus can hardly be so ignorant as not to have read or heard that narrators, when speaking of themselves, often use a construction as if speaking of another." (17:4) The fact that Faustus raised the objection isn't much of an argument that referring to yourself in the third person <i>wasn't</i> common, since Faustus also used a lot of other bad arguments. Read the remainder of section 17:1, for example, where Faustus accompanies his objection to Matthew's third-person language with other bad objections. Faustus was unreasonable about a lot of issues. Augustine seems to think Faustus was being dishonest: "It is more probable that Faustus wished to bewilder those more ignorant than himself, in the hope of getting hold on not a few unacquainted with these things." (17:4)Jason Engwerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17031011335190895123noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6789188.post-62150686548005704062018-05-13T16:03:48.597-04:002018-05-13T16:03:48.597-04:00That's why Bob Dole was such an awesome candid...That's why Bob Dole was such an awesome candidate. He never said a word about his own views on the campaign trail. It was an imposter the whole time. James A. Gibsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14816918735557659061noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6789188.post-37573018521085156772018-05-13T14:00:48.722-04:002018-05-13T14:00:48.722-04:00Yes, it's very well-known. (Fun fact: Russell ...Yes, it's very well-known. (Fun fact: Russell Kirk wrote his own autobiography in the third person. At first when one reads it one finds it insufferable, affected, annoying. But eventually one just gets used to it.) It's almost amusing that Bart Ehrman *still* brings up this chestnut of an objection when (if I recall correctly) St. Augustine answered the same thing when he heard it from Faustus back in the 300s.Lydia McGrewhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00423567323116960820noreply@blogger.com