tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6789188.post113952815092814727..comments2024-03-27T17:15:37.606-04:00Comments on Triablogue: The Universal Church and SBC Theology--IntroductionRyanhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17809283662428917799noreply@blogger.comBlogger3125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6789188.post-1164080463007966232006-11-20T22:41:00.000-05:002006-11-20T22:41:00.000-05:00"The New Testament speaks also of the church as th...<I>"The New Testament speaks also of the church as the Body of Christ which includes all of the redeemed of all the ages."<BR/><BR/>The key phrase is "all the ages." This includes past, present, and future ages. Obviously, the future is not yet here, and thus this church is not yet in existence. The statement is describing the church in glory, not a hypothetical, invisible, universal church of the present era. The redeemed of the future are not yet in existence, and the church described as including all the redeemed of all the ages is not yet in existence.</I><BR/><BR/>To know what this means, look to the one who wrote it, Dr. Hobbs. Hobbs was confronted with this objection from Pendleton, and he simply stated "Pendleton discusses the church in aggregate."<BR/><BR/>You are drawing distinctions he did not, himself, make. Nice try though.<BR/><BR/>As far as infants dying in infancy, there are five positions on this in Reformed Theology. You would do better to read Warfield.<BR/><BR/><I>The "invisible, universal church" does not include physically dead people from the past or people from the future who do not yet exist. The church in glory is a different concept from the "invisible, universal church."</I><BR/><BR/>This concept refers to God's conception of the church at any given time, sir. Is he aware of any persons that do not exist yet? Is He subject to time? Does he not know who the infants are dying in infancy?<BR/><BR/><I>The "invisible, universal church" is usually a reference to all Christians on earth at a particular point in time.</I><BR/><BR/>Here, sir, is the confessional definition of "universal church":<BR/><BR/>The catholic or universal church, which (with respect to the internal work of the Spirit and truth of grace) may be called invisible, consists of the whole number of the elect, that have been, are, <B><I>or shall be,</I> gathered into one, under Christ, the head thereof; and is the spouse, the body, the fulness of him that fills all in all.</B> Clearly, according to this defintion, it encompasses both your "glory church" and the composite of all believers on earth at any given time.GeneMBridgeshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10504383610477532374noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6789188.post-1139838161861142642006-02-13T08:42:00.000-05:002006-02-13T08:42:00.000-05:00Just pondering on your statement that, ". . . Dr. ...Just pondering on your statement that, ". . . Dr. John L. Dagg, who is likely the greatest theologian Southern Baptists have ever produced. . . . " Would you say that Dagg is greater than James P. Boyce, who was a professor and president of Southern Seminary? Boyce also published a systematic theology, <A HREF="http://www.founders.org/library/boyce1/toc.html" REL="nofollow"><I>Abstract of Systematic Theology</I></A>, published in 1887. I'm not necessarily disagreeing with your statement, but wanted to hear your thoughts on Boyce.<BR/><BR/>LewisLewis Noleshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06187387820658051979noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6789188.post-1139583867806680802006-02-10T10:04:00.000-05:002006-02-10T10:04:00.000-05:00Great post! One of my professors was a Landmarkist...Great post! One of my professors was a Landmarkist in his younger days, but came to reject it and was promptly excommunicated. He told us all about it.<BR/><BR/>Also, I was wondering exactly how Theo's objection actually contradicts anything you said. No one disagress with the statement "all the ages," and his basic explanation seems correct- but how does it in any way contradict the concept of the universal church? Can I affirm that the universal church existed in 'all the ages?' If anything, these statements tend to reinforce my belief in the universal church.Chuckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00778739900054130935noreply@blogger.com